HOCNA: Bp Demetrius’ Statement

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September 17, 2012

HOCNA: Bp Demetrius’ Statement

Bp Demetrius’ newest statement, issued today, was read on NFTU Radio, and posted here after the show.

http://www.blogtalkradio.com/nftu/2012/09/17/nftu-radio-tba

The statement is below:

  • nephongoc

    He was accepted into the Synod of Kallinikos and given the title of Boston as an assistant to Metropolitan Pavlos.

    • NFTU

      I’m on it 🙂

      In Christ,
      Deacon Joseph Suaiden
      St Eulalia Orthodox Mission Chapel, Yonkers NY:
      *A Mission of the Orthodox Metropolia in North America*
      *Autonomous Orthodox Metropolia of North and South America and the British Isles*
      *
      *
      “Let these canonical rules be established by us for you, O ye bishops; and if you continue to observe them, ye shall be saved, and shall have peace; but if you be disobedient, you shall be punished, and have everlasting war one with another, and undergo a penalty suitable to your disobedience.” *–Epilogue to the Apostolic Constitutions
      *

  • Anna Khan

    And as of yesterday he is archbishop. The lesson here is that if you leave HOCNA you will rise up in the ranks.

    • NFTU

      And IN HOCNA, if you follow what Fr Panteleimon says, no matter how immoral, you can also rise up in the ranks.

      I’ve had enough. “Anna Khan” (if you’re not just Fr P) I’ve just about lost my patience with you and any other fake identity that comes here trying to make your leaders look like victims.

      I am not a fan of the GOC-Kallinikos (I try to avoid partisanship) but I’ve had it with this victim-spiel when you people are defending heresy. The fact that you are defending what in any other circle would be called a “dirty old man” is repugnant.

      Please remove yourself from this website or I’ll do it for you.

      In Christ,
      Deacon Joseph Suaiden
      St Eulalia Orthodox Mission Chapel, Yonkers NY:
      *A Mission of the Orthodox Metropolia in North America*
      *Autonomous Orthodox Metropolia of North and South America and the British Isles*
      *
      *
      “Let these canonical rules be established by us for you, O ye bishops; and if you continue to observe them, ye shall be saved, and shall have peace; but if you be disobedient, you shall be punished, and have everlasting war one with another, and undergo a penalty suitable to your disobedience.” *–Epilogue to the Apostolic Constitutions
      *

      • George

        I wouldnt put much thought into this “Anna” person. Every single point that “she” has made has been incorrect including what “she” wrote above. As much credibility as her buddy Fr Panteleimon at this point…

        • disqus_PkcQeh2mbn

          As for you George, I put my real name on every single post. I’m not afraid of what people will say about me. The statements that I post are true because I have been witness to them. Including when ephraim said “anathema” to name worshipping and name worshippers. I was at the meeting and I heard it from his own mouth. And also I’ve had limited interaction with fr panteleimon. But I grew up going to the monastery every week and have had tons of interaction with fr issac. All I’m saying is that maybe greed and power started this whole mess. People need to dig in deeper and investigate. Yours truly, Anna khan.

          • George

            Actually that’s a lie. The issue is that almost every single statement you’ve made has been false. Even the statement above where you claim that Bishop Demetrius was made Archbishop is wrong. And most of your comments you’ve started with “I heard”. Meaning, you’ve posted slanderous comments of Orthodox Heirarchs based on *gossip*. What started “all this (recent) mess” was two different heresies, and what started a longer term “30 year” mess was due to the coverups of Fr Isaac and M. Ephraim of Fr Panteleimons activities. You dont need to dig any further than that “Anna”.

          • John Collis

            Anna: Please use some discernment. If Bp. Ephraim was so opposed to name-worshippers, why was Lourie given Holy Communion at HTM not long ago? It’s not credible for him to have only recently become knowedgeable about this heresy. Why did Fr. Haralambos and Fr. Basil, in good standing with HTM, come out against it in such detail. Consider the following example. Someone says “I am a hockey fan”. When asked “Have you ever been to a hockey game?”, “Do you skate?” “Do you have a favorite team?”, “Do you play hockey in any form?”, “What’s your favorite position?”, or “Would you like tickets for a game?” they answer answer negatively or evasively, (i.e. “No”, “I don’t know”, “That’s not an important consideration for a hockey fan”). They would look like a complete idiot or fool. What has that someone gained by saying, “I like hockey”? You heard him say, “I am a hockey fan”, and will defend his lip service against every criticism of what is actions or lack of actions have shown. HOCNA Bishops have made subtle assertions in support of a known and complicated heresy, then comforted their adherents with soundbites like “Anathema to name worshipping and name worshippers”. Why did they ever bring this up? Why have so many good people left over this recent heresy? Why didn’t they just drop it when they could see the damage that would result again? Despite your anger and hatred at those who have left, don’t you feel some loss – with greater discernment, shouldn’t they have had some anticipation and concern for the greater division their continued actions would bring about? During our information sessions at St. Nektarios, I recall many of the calm smiling responses to “Awake, Sleeper!”, as being “That’s not what we mean”. You’re vociferously defending the elderly, fatherly, weakly smiling men – don’t pick on these vulnerable people I love and cherish.

            Wake up.

            These are wolves in sheeps’ clothing dragging your souls to hades.

      • disqus_PkcQeh2mbn

        I’m a real woman with children deacon. Why remove me? Don’t you want your readers to see both sides of the situation? I only point out what I’ve witnessed. As hard as it is to believe, fr christos is not an angel. And neither is bishop Demetrius.

        • disqus_PkcQeh2mbn

          You did remove me. No problem. Unlike other people I’m not afraid to show my true identity. You are just like fr christos, deacon Joseph. Whoever doesn’t agree with him gets shunned.

          • Boston

            Anna,
            You should be able to post, but why do you post rumors? Anything that you heard from someone else and that cannot be independently verified is a rumor and potentially slander.

            Example: People are saying that Deacon Joseph ate a sesame seed bagel with margarine. <– Rumor, unconfirmable by you or anyone else.

            Fr. Bill says that someone told him that Deacon Joseph ate a sesame bagel with margarine. <– Rumor. We don't know Fr. Bill's source. You yourself can't be sure that either Fr. Bill or his source or his source's source, etc. misheard or said something false, and there's no way to confirm it.

            Fr. Bill told me that he saw Deacon Joseph eating a sesame seed bagel with margarine. <– Better, now at least we have a source who actually saw this that we can consult.

            Christians should not spread rumors period, and that goes for both sides in this mess, even if you absolutely believe that your side is right. The great and holy fathers of the church engaged the heretics of their day point by point in a rational way, and who was more right than them?

            Do not go about spreading slander among your people. Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the Lord. (Leviticus 19:16)
            Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. (I Thess 5:21)

          • NFTU

            I’m staying out of this. I am just sick and tired of this equivocation.
            As a former member of HOCNA who did my best as the years went to be positive about them, this series of events actually makes me really angry. And you know what? That’s probably not even one-thousandth as angry as people who devoted their whole lives to the monastery were when this happened and people who had lived there in some cases for decades decided to go to the Kallinikos Synod to live in a refitted barn.

            So yes, knowing the locales, knowing that people devoted their lives and felt betrayed, knowing the priest who baptized me left too, knowing what they gave up, sorry. This whole “oh, that’s just some ambitious monks” implies that the author thinks we don’t know anything about HOCNA and we are getting “bad information”. That can only be compared to “bad experience”, which is why it seems more than half the monastery fled to Woodstock. Many of us have good friends there, and some estranged friends.
            The whole thing makes me sick, and I am staying out of it. Not because “I don’t get it”. But because seeing the depths of what my former Church had become makes me feel a little bit dead inside.

            In Christ,
            Deacon Joseph Suaiden
            St Eulalia Orthodox Mission Chapel, Yonkers NY:
            *A Mission of the Orthodox Metropolia in North America*
            *Autonomous Orthodox Metropolia of North and South America and the British Isles*
            *
            *
            “Let these canonical rules be established by us for you, O ye bishops; and if you continue to observe them, ye shall be saved, and shall have peace; but if you be disobedient, you shall be punished, and have everlasting war one with another, and undergo a penalty suitable to your disobedience.” *–Epilogue to the Apostolic Constitutions
            *

    • GOC Raleigh

      According to whom? How could he get the title of Archbishop, which
      would make him outrank Metropolitan Pavlos and be equal in rank to
      Archbishop Kallinikos of Athens? Think about it.

      • GOC Raleigh

        Instead of getting into the fray or the “he said, she said” stuff, let me try to post a constructive hypothesis of what this may be about.

        In the Greek typicon, the local ruling bishop (who in Greece is almost always of the rank Metropolitan) is commemorated in the liturgy as “Our Archbishop {name}” regardless of the fact that he is a Metropolitan. So, for instance, the one time I liturgized in Met. Moses’s diocese, I commemorated him as “Our Archbishop Moses.” No one should construe from this that he somehow got a promotion when no one was paying attention. 😉

        Perhaps then, someone commemorated Bishop Demetrius in his own Cathedral as “Our Archbishop Demetrius?”

        This would seem odd to me for the fact that Bishop Demetrius’s diocese is subject to the Metropolis of America, and currently they are to do double commemoration of Metropolitan Pavlos and Bishop Demetrius. So, for instance, when I was at liturgy in Richmond, VA on Sunday, I heard commemorated “Our Archbishop Pavlos and Our Bishop Demetrius.” I would be surprised if then someone commemorated Bishop Demetrius as “Our Archbishop” due to the fact that Metropolitan Pavlos is also supposed to be commemorated first. However, that leads to the inevitable fact that:

        Things are complicated in Church administration and canonical structures, and perhaps someone just got confused!

        Let’s go with assuming the best before we assume the worst…

        • Kym Brophy

          WOW! I’m a Roman
          Catholic who was looking into the differences of Orthodox and Roman
          Catholic…I happened on a list of differences written by Father Michael Azkoul
          that were so nasty and accusatory that I googled him to find out more and
          landed on this post. Imagine my surprise when I saw how irreverent and nasty
          every comment is here….Seriously, I’m shocked! Where is the respect for
          others? Where is your quest to honor those around you and be grateful for the
          gifts that God has given to you? I guess my first impression of Orthodoxy from
          Father Michael Azkoul is unfortunately true for many people on this website.
          Wow…..just wow!
          And yes, this is my real name……

          • NA

            Kym, consider this website as seeing family members of a family you don’t know fighting with each other. It would all seem unnecessary and trite, especially without the proper context.

            Perhaps it would be good for all of us to be reminded that our posts are public and we should act here the same as if we were out in the open.

            Now, as to Father Michael’s list (http://www.ocf.org/OrthodoxPage/reading/ortho_cath.html): I see him being more brutally honest about the differences between the Orthodox and Catholics than nasty. Most of his observations are just a simple comparison of the differences in each doctrine.

            Try this video for a bit of a different perspective. It is from the priest who posted above: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ID1-J8jmgM

          • John Collis

            Kym: Welcome to our forum. Sorry that you’ve stumbled upon our little feud. We are all passionate about defending the Faith, especially when we disagree. Words may seem harsh, but this is because we have found ourselves severed from our loved ones over matters of the Faith. The heart of those sincere in the Faith yearns mostly for us to all be in Communion again, but within the Faith. Review Matthew 10:34-39.

            In a nutshell, if you need to understand the differences between mainstream Roman Catholicism, and our true Orthodox Christian Faith, consider a recent example.

            On May 14, 1999 Pope John Paul II entered a mosque, knelt before the Koran and kissed it. The Koran blasphemes the Holy Trinity and denies the Divinty of Christ. I have nice muslim friends, and we all hope(d) for the Pope’s salvation, but any Orthodox leader doing this would have been completely discredited, and abandoned – likely had his beard shaved too (if he had one). The Faith is not only about peace, love, doing good worldy things, but following the truth and never compromising it for false worldly praise or “peace”.
            If you understand why sentiment is important, please continue your research. If you don’t, you need a primer on the Faith.